Killing effects of paper patched bullets in 45/70 and 45/110

[pete]

I think it's great if guys want to use paper patch bullets with history in mind but their effectiveness for hunting I think is more a matter of them being made from soft pure lead or 40-1 alloy than the paper patch factor. The same results can be got with soft grease groove bullets too. I shoot pure lead grease grooves and they have worked great so far. My experience has been limited to two buffalo both of which were heart lung shot under hunting conditions, one deer and one antelope. All with 45-70's and Lyman 457193 420 gr. pure lead bullets. Granted this isn't a large sample size but all results were favorable. Some expanding to over .900.
John Hansen at Sandhills ranch said the mistake most guys make is showing up with bullets that are too hard, 20-1 or harder. They don't expand and just go through.

[The Montanan]

Pete

Your absolutly correct, and if I get my mold done by Steve Brooks that is what I am going to cast mine with is pure lead. These that I have on hand now are 30:1 and should work with no problems.

The nice thing is that I can use it in either my 45-70 or my 45-90.

[tom ball]

Pete, I agree also, but one can't generally shoot naked pure lead bullets very fast without leading. However,I really just like working up and using paper patch loads like most of the old timers used. John Cook, the Wyoming market hunter of the 1870's and 80's,stated that hunters that are particular about their ammunition use paper patch bullets. He used a Sharps 40/90. Other famous hunters that used paper patched bullets were J. Wright Moore and Jim White. These two were the boss hunters and they killed about 20,000 buffalo each during their career while using paper patched bullets in their Sharps Big 50's. One of my all time favorites is Colonel Pickett who hunted in Wyoming and Montana during the 1870's and 80's. He was one of the greatest grizzly bear hunters ever. He preferred the Sharps in
45 2 7/8 with paper patched ammo. I could go on with many more famous hunters that preferred paper patch bullets. Don't get me wrong, grease grooved bullets were used too, but the majority of hunters during the 1870's and 80's preferred paper patch ammo in their Sharps, Rolling Blocks and Ballards. I shoot pure lead grease groove bullets in my 45/70, but when one starts putting together loads for a 45/110 using a 500 grain bullet and 110 grains of powder, leading becomes a problem just like during the buffalo hunting period. Paper patch bullets eliminate this problem. They were the jacketed bullets of their day and they are more fun than I can stand! Thanks, Tom

[Headhunter]

I have just settled on my load, after digging the bullet out of a clay bank.

I am shooting a 45-110 with 110 grains of 1-F, and a 550 grain Paper Patch bullet from Montana Precision.

The bullet was a perfect mushroom and retained 549.7 grains. DANG!

this load shoots 2" at 200 sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. What a thumper!

Headhunter

[canuck4570]

I have a real blunt nose 500-gr bullet called an Elk Buster, just wished it could be paper patched. As a friend of mine got Steve Brooks to make him a mold from some samples that I sent him of the super hard cast one, he now cast bullets that are of 30:1 and sent me a box.

For a hunting bullet these are very nice and in 30:1 now they will work much better.

could you give me the net adress for steve brooks mould .... his hollow point interest me... thank you

[opencountry]

I have been working toward the 'perfect' hunting load and bullet the last three months. I shoot a #1 Sporter, chamber .45/70. I've been using Buffalo Arm's bullets (.440500T) and .002 light blue 100% cotton patch. PP bullets is all I have shot through this new rifle. My patched bullets leave a second shot difficult without wiping the bore, as they measure about .451 patched. Your dramatically tapered bullets from Montana Precision really sound good. I have recovered some of my bullets out of a hill of sand behing the 100 and 200 yd. ranges, and thought I'd show them. They're pure lead with a cupped base and a 3/16" flat nose. I like your idea of filing the point down even more for more expansion, and quicker kills. Take a look...

[tom ball]

To Open Country: I shoot the tapered bullets also with great results, but found that sometimes they didn't open up much at 300 yards or so even in the longer cases. Just for fun try the .440 diam. straight sided 500 grain swaged bulet from Mont. Prec. Swaging. They take a little experimentation to get to shoot, but when they do, they are really fast killers of large game! In the 45/70 try 80 to 85 grs. Swiss 2F, 1/8" lube cookie and 9 lb. paper and then coat dry patch with Rooster Red Bullet Lube. In the 45/110 try 120 grs. of Swiss 2F with same bullet and patch combo and use a .030 wad in 45/85 load and a .060 wad for the 45/110 load. These loads kill like lightening.