40-70 Sharps Straight, Smokeless
Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:22 pm
First let me preface what will follow here. I have fielded numerous inquiries from guys that are interested in loading their 40-70ss's with smokeless powder and are at a loss how to proceed. This is intended to simply put out in public what I have learned. It is not intended to be definitive. My opinions and conclusions are my own so value them at the price you paid for them. I do not wish to discuss the smokeless vs. black powder debate. Use what makes you happy.
A couple of other things:
1) There is no bullet under discussion here that is not procured or sized to .408". I will not discuss any other diameter.
2) Both my 40-70ss rifles are Shilohs. Any references to chamber dimensions are based on Shiloh's reamers.
3) All loads were assembled in R-P stretched 30-40 Krag cases from Bufflalo Arms. I know of and have used the 405 Winchester cases from Hornady, but they were not used here. If you wish to use them in the Shiloh chamber use caution. The 405 case has less powder capacity than the Krag, it is also thicker in the neck and the case web extends much higher up the body of the case.
The bullets:
The first three bullets were purchased at the .408" diameter. They are the Hawk 300gr round tip, the Hawk 300gr spitzer (may still be special order) and the Woodleigh Weld-Core 400gr.
The center of this picture shows a Corbin bullet sizing die that reduces .411"-.412" bullets to .408".
The last two bullets are the Hornady 210gr. 41 Mag. XTP and the 300 gr. 405 Winchester bullet. Both these bullets HAVE BEEN SIZED TO .408"!!! I cannot emphasize enough that all the bullets under discussion are .408".
Here are most of the bullets as loaded rounds in overall length to go through an unaltered Shiloh chamber.
I have been loading H4895 exclusively. I know that 3031 has a strong following with such loads but I don't like it for some reason. Chronograph numbers have been a little flakey with 3031 so I just let it go. Anyway, I have been using the starting loads for 405 Winchester as my guide and have decided that 50.0gr of H4895 is about as high as I am prepared to go with a 300gr. bullet. In fact, I have settled at 48.5 as my standard load with most 300gr bullets.
The best of the hunting bullets for hogs and deer sized animals have been the Hawk 300gr Round Tip. It has been accurate and it kills all out of proportion to what it should. If may be the pure lead/pure copper combination. I have long suspected that the gilding metal in modern bullets was a bit stiff, I dunno. The Hawk is great. The spitzer seemed like perfect idea, but oddly enough I can hear a difference when the bullet strikes a feral pig. The round tip hits harder and I even think it may hold a bit straighter course inside the animal. The both kill fine but I like the round tip a bit better. My standard load of 48.5grs of H4895 produces 2025fps out of my 26" barreled Shiloh. For those of you keeping score at home that is 2732ft-lbs of kinetic energy and a T-KO of 35.4. Which is not too shabby in my estimation.
Here are a couple of recovered Hawks:
The bullet on the left was recovered from a prehistoric sized feral sow. She was quartering on and the bullet broke the on-side shoulder going in and traversed about 30" of hog before stopping just under the skin on the offside just in front of the ham.
The bullet on the right was recovered from just under the off-side skin of a 200lb sow. As you can see it has shed its jacket. When I fired at the sow, about 90 yards out, I thought she was a single. What I didn't know is that there was a second sow standing shoulder to shoulder with the one I shot. This bullet went through the shoulder area of TWO feral hogs. Thats four shoulders, which seems to be very good performance to me.
Post to be continued at time permits. I have several other areas that I want to cover that may be of use.
J
A couple of other things:
1) There is no bullet under discussion here that is not procured or sized to .408". I will not discuss any other diameter.
2) Both my 40-70ss rifles are Shilohs. Any references to chamber dimensions are based on Shiloh's reamers.
3) All loads were assembled in R-P stretched 30-40 Krag cases from Bufflalo Arms. I know of and have used the 405 Winchester cases from Hornady, but they were not used here. If you wish to use them in the Shiloh chamber use caution. The 405 case has less powder capacity than the Krag, it is also thicker in the neck and the case web extends much higher up the body of the case.
The bullets:
The first three bullets were purchased at the .408" diameter. They are the Hawk 300gr round tip, the Hawk 300gr spitzer (may still be special order) and the Woodleigh Weld-Core 400gr.
The center of this picture shows a Corbin bullet sizing die that reduces .411"-.412" bullets to .408".
The last two bullets are the Hornady 210gr. 41 Mag. XTP and the 300 gr. 405 Winchester bullet. Both these bullets HAVE BEEN SIZED TO .408"!!! I cannot emphasize enough that all the bullets under discussion are .408".
Here are most of the bullets as loaded rounds in overall length to go through an unaltered Shiloh chamber.
I have been loading H4895 exclusively. I know that 3031 has a strong following with such loads but I don't like it for some reason. Chronograph numbers have been a little flakey with 3031 so I just let it go. Anyway, I have been using the starting loads for 405 Winchester as my guide and have decided that 50.0gr of H4895 is about as high as I am prepared to go with a 300gr. bullet. In fact, I have settled at 48.5 as my standard load with most 300gr bullets.
The best of the hunting bullets for hogs and deer sized animals have been the Hawk 300gr Round Tip. It has been accurate and it kills all out of proportion to what it should. If may be the pure lead/pure copper combination. I have long suspected that the gilding metal in modern bullets was a bit stiff, I dunno. The Hawk is great. The spitzer seemed like perfect idea, but oddly enough I can hear a difference when the bullet strikes a feral pig. The round tip hits harder and I even think it may hold a bit straighter course inside the animal. The both kill fine but I like the round tip a bit better. My standard load of 48.5grs of H4895 produces 2025fps out of my 26" barreled Shiloh. For those of you keeping score at home that is 2732ft-lbs of kinetic energy and a T-KO of 35.4. Which is not too shabby in my estimation.
Here are a couple of recovered Hawks:
The bullet on the left was recovered from a prehistoric sized feral sow. She was quartering on and the bullet broke the on-side shoulder going in and traversed about 30" of hog before stopping just under the skin on the offside just in front of the ham.
The bullet on the right was recovered from just under the off-side skin of a 200lb sow. As you can see it has shed its jacket. When I fired at the sow, about 90 yards out, I thought she was a single. What I didn't know is that there was a second sow standing shoulder to shoulder with the one I shot. This bullet went through the shoulder area of TWO feral hogs. Thats four shoulders, which seems to be very good performance to me.
Post to be continued at time permits. I have several other areas that I want to cover that may be of use.
J