BP for .45 Colt

grif · Post by **grif** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 9:43 pm

1st, thanks to everybody, have gotten some great info from you guys.
The BP bug has bitten hard, after shooting my Shilo #3 45/70 for the past year, (managed to shoot an elk with it this fall) I recently bought a muzzleloading 10 ga. from Pedersoli. It does a pretty good job on geese. My smokeless arsenal hasn't been getting much work lately.

My question is, do any of you have experience loading BP for .45 Colt, I plan to shoot my Ruger Blackhawk and maybe even my Interarms Model 65 lever action carbine. Anything you know would be helpful. The only loading data I have found is for cap and ball revolvers. In a .44 the load shown is 35 gr. FFFG for round ball and conical. I had planned to use some excess FF and can fit 30 gr. with little compression, will top it off with 250 gr. cast bullet. The Ruger is strongly built and can handle some hot loads in smokeless, couldn't see where BP would build too much pressure even if I compressed every grain of BP possible into the case.
Just wanted another opinion.

Grif

Howard Haworth · Post by **Howard Haworth** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:51 pm

Hello Grif, I shoot black in my cowboy guns 45Colt SSA & EMF 1866 and a Cimiron 1872 opentop 45 Scofield. I use 35 grains of 2f in the 45 Colt and 30 grains in the Scofield. I melt the hard lube off the hard cast 250 grain rnfp and lube with Paul Mathews lub and the same with the 200 grain for the Scofield. I can shoot an entire 5 or 6 stage match with out cleaning the pistols but need to clean the rifle every two stages. I think a lube cookie for the rifle would help this problem. Just have not got around to finding out yet. Hope this helps a little. Howard

Bumper · Post by **Bumper** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 6:30 am

I've used 35gr of 3f in 45Colt but if I'm in a hurry a Pyrodex pellet works just as well with 250>255gr bullets. Rbump

Jerry Williams · Post by **Jerry Williams** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 8:26 am

Grif, I have tested about every BP load there is for cowboy action shooting and in the .45 Colt I like Pyradex RS. I don't have the amount here in front of me but fill to the base of the bullet. Lee makes a six gang 250 grain bullet with a real large grease grove. I think Pigon Roust Slim or some such cowboy designed it. If you can get your hands on this bullet mold, USE IT! It just make thinks a lot easier. Good luck.

Lee Stone · Post by **Lee Stone** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 1:36 pm

I have one of the Pigeon Roost Slim, .45 calibre, 6 gang Lee moulds. It throws really great .454, 250 grain, flat point bullets with huge grease grooves. They work great in my model '73 carbine. However, as I understand it, this was a one off run and I don't believe Lee put it into their regular inventory. Maybe someone convinced (as in paying the production fee) Lee to produce another run of them but I haven't heard of it. It is a really good mould and I am normally not a fan of aluminium moulds.

grif · Post by **grif** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 10:28 pm

Thanks guys, appreciate the help. Didn't even think about getting rid of the hard lube.

Bearclaw McCabe · Post by **Bearclaw McCabe** » Fri Feb 06, 2004 4:30 pm

For what it's worth, I shoot a lot of .45 BP in Cowboy Action Shooting and have used both BP lubed and regular lubed bullets. To date I have seen no difference in accuracy or in fouling.

Now before someone bites my head off, let me say that I believe in good BP lube for shooting ACCURATE BP loads. I used the smokeless lubed bullets mainly because I had a lot of them and wanted to see what they would do. They did great and I had no problems with fouling the entire shoot. Haven't had a problem since either. I have another pard who only shoots smokeless lubed bullets on top of BP and we both can shoot a five/six stage match (100+rounds) without a problem. For most uses with the .45 Colt, either bullet works great in my Vaquero's and Yellowboy. If I were shooting for long range accuracy I would go with a good BP lube but for general or Cowboy shooting I use whichever bullets I happen to have on hand.

Bearbait2 · Post by **Bearbait2** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 10:13 am

Bearclaw,
Our experience has been the same.
Shoot Straight

Bearclaw McCabe · Post by **Bearclaw McCabe** » Mon Feb 09, 2004 6:16 pm

Hey there Bearbait2, how ya doing up that way?? Looks like we are just about on opposite ends of the country, with me being on the Mississippi gulf coast and all and you being clean up on top!!
Thanks for the comeback. I find it very interesting that you experienced the same results. I woulda kinda figured that with the cold and all you guys might need the BP lube more. I WAS surprised to find that even with our high heat I really didn't need the BP lube for Cowboy Action Shooting. I appreciate your reply and information. Seems that I learn something new just about every day!
Thanks again and take care!

ffffgdave@yahoo.com · Tue Feb 10, 2004 12:45 am

in my opionion your lead hardness is critical for hunting.. if your after small game a soft even pure lead bullet will be fine.. as the game gets tougher the need for pennetration is important.. hard hard bullets dont obturate with black powder so some experimenting is important. my better pennetration/ accuracy load for black powder and bullet is cci 300 primer,37 1/2 gr equiv 2f goex, 20-1 lead/tin keith bullet, ................ crimp, expander, comprssion is very important to accuracey.. i like to crimp on a band rather than a groove as the case can possibley size bullet with softer construction.. with the low velocity of bp the 20/1 bullet gets better pennetration on tough game like 2x4s and the small dead trees. and gives just enough obturation for accuracy in my cimmeron.. each gun is different tho..have field cleaning pouch for black and clean every six rounds or if not shooting for awhile you cant let fouling set and harden in barrel or accuracy will go to poo.. for instance if you shoot a round at 8am put gun in holster and shoot at a deer at noon you may hit the deer standing next to it... but fireing about 5-6 rounds in a row will give acceptabel accuracy with a good well lubed load.. (:<)>... , .. good luck dave...

Bearclaw McCabe · Post by **Bearclaw McCabe** » Tue Feb 10, 2004 12:34 pm

I couldn't agree more. For hunting or for real accuracy the lube, crimp, compression, etc. are all very important. When I said the lube didn't matter, I mean't strictly for Cowboy Action Shooting. We don't have to worry about serious accuracy, just making the target go plink.
I prefer to use BP lube but often end up with a lot of bullets that have the smokeless lube so I use them. If I were hunting or when I am shooting for real accuracy, I go the entire BP route.
Thanks for the input!

KHR · Post by **KHR** » Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:00 pm

Grif,
Here's my 2 cents, I shoot a lot of 44-40 BP and clearshot for cowboy action. here is my setup:

I use a Dillon 650 with the BlackPowder modification that allows loading BP. After resizing, I use the rifle size powder measure to get enough in the case. The next station uses a compression die and .030 wad (both from Buffalo Arms) to compress the powder / Clearshot. This is so I dont distort the bullet through compressing the powder, for black I use a RCBS 44-40 poured from 30-1. lubed with spg. for clear shot I use a commercial 44-40 hard cast.

I have also tryed the pyrodex pellet, put a wonder wad above it for lube.

The bp load is a great hunting load and is kinda stout for competition, i use cleanshot for competition. The key idea is that there is no extra airspace in the case. I can load about 400 rounds a hour using this setup.

keith

Bearbait2 · Post by **Bearbait2** » Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:57 am

KHR,
If you don't mind our asking, what brand of case are you using and how much BP are you able to get into the case?
Thank you.
Shoot Straight