Heart Medicine vs New Shiloh Rifle
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Lee Stone
- Posts: 2817
- Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 2:27 pm
- Location: Lacombe, Louisiana, USA
- Contact:
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RichBratlee
- Posts: 313
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2003 8:21 pm
- Location: Parkland(Tacoma), WA
Kenny--HERE HERE-_To all your sentiments---been there seen that--and now (especially as I was in KY for awhile there were alot of em around and same attitudes you described) so a couple of us started celeberating hirosima and nagasaki day and Guadal Canal day etc,--kinda pissed them off but we made our point--nuff said
Now to guns and especially these big ol' side hammer beauties--a question for ya--I am looking at either an LRE or #1 in 45-110--34" tube set up for Long range--out of those 2 which would be your preference--just curious
Thanks Rich
Now to guns and especially these big ol' side hammer beauties--a question for ya--I am looking at either an LRE or #1 in 45-110--34" tube set up for Long range--out of those 2 which would be your preference--just curious
Thanks Rich
SHILOH 1
USN EM1 (78-83)
Sporter#3 45-70 military butt 34" standard MVA Long range and MVA standard front insert
People with weapons are citizens: People without are subjects!!
USN EM1 (78-83)
Sporter#3 45-70 military butt 34" standard MVA Long range and MVA standard front insert
People with weapons are citizens: People without are subjects!!
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Kenny Wasserburger
- Posts: 4740
- Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2002 3:53 pm
- Location: Gillette, Wyoming
Rich,
As I recall, Per Kirk the only difference is that the LR Express has a Cheek piece. It has no rear dovetail also. IT is set up pretty much as what I was wanting a LR Sharps Target rifle. Its sort of a Cross between a Creedmoor and a Buffalo rifle, Least thats My opinion. They will run about 13 lbs with a #1 heavy Full oct barrel. My Sihouette rifle is the same but with the heavy half and it just made wt at 34 inches. Couple years back I decided to have Kirk take the first 2 inches off the muzzle as we had a bit of a boo booo. I cleaned the rifle one afternoon after a session at the range ran to get some stuff and did not oil the barrel when daughter got home she turned on the swamp cooler in a very hot house. I got a few nice red fuzzys in the muzzle of the barrel first inch or two. IT Took the finish off the inside of the barrel in 2 or 3 spots not actual pitting but it bothered me non the less.
I was using Elephant Powder at the time and well with its extra fouling I was tired of having to blow so much. So 2 inches came off and the rifle even now with its XXX Fancy Wood runs in at 11.74 lbs. She got a major face lift last year at Shiloh, Chance took some real pains to make this rifle much more then it was originaly. Its run alot of matches done the barrel and been from KS To CA shooting. She looks very nice now, bone pack, XXX wood XX finish brass escutions, shnable on the PG.
My other rifle, Pure Poison, the 45-110 has French Gray finish, the old style and its worn some, The side plate of the action has my initals engraved into it with nothing fancy no Puter, Just Semi Fancy wood. She has seen lots of matches, and it shows on the lock plate I have worn the finish off from sweat and my grip. When ever it comes out of the big wagon box I have for it folks know what rifle that one is. When the chips are down and I want to shoot well at LR this is the rifle that I go get.
Kirk wants to refinish it, some day perhaps? The barrel has had LOTS of rounds down it and it still shots well. I might retire it when I get my borchardt. Every time Kirk gets his paws on it the refinish thing comes up, I have to take it away from him and put it back in the Wagon box. I have one gun collector that would love to buy it, I told him its not for sale. Krystal thinks that it should stay in the family and I tend to agree with her.
Its been a big part of my life for about almost 10 years.
Kenny Wasserburger
As I recall, Per Kirk the only difference is that the LR Express has a Cheek piece. It has no rear dovetail also. IT is set up pretty much as what I was wanting a LR Sharps Target rifle. Its sort of a Cross between a Creedmoor and a Buffalo rifle, Least thats My opinion. They will run about 13 lbs with a #1 heavy Full oct barrel. My Sihouette rifle is the same but with the heavy half and it just made wt at 34 inches. Couple years back I decided to have Kirk take the first 2 inches off the muzzle as we had a bit of a boo booo. I cleaned the rifle one afternoon after a session at the range ran to get some stuff and did not oil the barrel when daughter got home she turned on the swamp cooler in a very hot house. I got a few nice red fuzzys in the muzzle of the barrel first inch or two. IT Took the finish off the inside of the barrel in 2 or 3 spots not actual pitting but it bothered me non the less.
I was using Elephant Powder at the time and well with its extra fouling I was tired of having to blow so much. So 2 inches came off and the rifle even now with its XXX Fancy Wood runs in at 11.74 lbs. She got a major face lift last year at Shiloh, Chance took some real pains to make this rifle much more then it was originaly. Its run alot of matches done the barrel and been from KS To CA shooting. She looks very nice now, bone pack, XXX wood XX finish brass escutions, shnable on the PG.
My other rifle, Pure Poison, the 45-110 has French Gray finish, the old style and its worn some, The side plate of the action has my initals engraved into it with nothing fancy no Puter, Just Semi Fancy wood. She has seen lots of matches, and it shows on the lock plate I have worn the finish off from sweat and my grip. When ever it comes out of the big wagon box I have for it folks know what rifle that one is. When the chips are down and I want to shoot well at LR this is the rifle that I go get.
Kirk wants to refinish it, some day perhaps? The barrel has had LOTS of rounds down it and it still shots well. I might retire it when I get my borchardt. Every time Kirk gets his paws on it the refinish thing comes up, I have to take it away from him and put it back in the Wagon box. I have one gun collector that would love to buy it, I told him its not for sale. Krystal thinks that it should stay in the family and I tend to agree with her.
Its been a big part of my life for about almost 10 years.
Kenny Wasserburger
We'll raise up our Glasses against Evil Forces, Singing, Whiskey for my men, Beer for my horses.
Wyoming Territory Sharps Shooter
Wyoming Territory Sharps Shooter
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Omak Cowboy
- Posts: 726
- Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 2:35 pm
- Location: Renton, Washington
a few thoughts
Kenny and all:
Over the past year or so I've posted here I've come to know a few of you by the words you write. Kenny, I believe is a good, honest and decent man. He is someone I'd like for a neighbor.
Most of us here are over 40 and a few of us well over that. In our lives many of us have been both well treated and at times ill used by people of many lands and many colors. The people who were laughing at the Arizona Memorial did an unforgivable thing. That was way beyond bad manners and I would not have felt it out of place if some Marine had walked over and flattened a few of those SOBs. Wouldn't mind doing it myself...and I could make it all look like they started it!
By the way, General Sweeney who flew the chase plane over Hiroshima and bombed Nagasaki wrote a very important book "Wars End" in which he has a first person account of when, how and why.
For well beyond 35 years I've studied Asian cultures, Japanese, some Chinese, Thai and a smattering of others. I know something about these people. Sadly I probably know more about thier early culture and what compells them today then many born in those lands.
FYI one the Mongols:
The invasion of Japan by China under Kubli Khan was in 1281. While the Khan was Mongol, the force was mostly Korean and hence the poor feelings between the two societies. The two different stories about the invasion was that the fleet did not make landfall or did make landfall and had to immediately retreat to their ships who were destroyed by the "Kami" the spirit of the divine wind. Did they or didn't they? Who knows?
In the 35 opps 39 years I've studied this culture, I've found many things to admire. I've also seen and experienced other things that are A. Dumb, B. Stupid, C. Deplorable, D. Bad manners beyond belief, and E. Criminal in the extreme. Yet none of these things condemns a people.
The tragic part of history is that in Japan there is no education of the young on what really happened in World War II. There is no mention of Nan King, Batann, the forced prostitution of Korean girls, the attempt to use bio weapons on the US by sending plague ridden rats in balloons nor of the attempt firebombing of our north west forests, nothing on the "medical experiments' by the Japanese version of Mengela, the execution of our POWs by beheading, and on and on.
Kenny you are too young to remember the anti German feelings in this country at the end of W.W.II. And you may not even know that at the end of W.W.I anything German was hated. Poor little dachshund puppies were stoned to death in the streets because they were "German"! Places long known as "German" were changed' German Valley in New Jersey became Long Valley. The shame of being German or of having anything to do with Germany was for years a stain that nothing could wash off. A Kraut was a Kraut and "We ALL know about those people, don't we?" was the sometime spoken and often just a silent agreement between people of "Breeding".
But those dedicated to hating others need little reason and no excuise. Another word I know of is "Half breed", though no one dared say that to my grandfather's face either about his children or grandchildren. Once a school principal, upon expelling my mother for getting to class late because she was dragging 20 pounds of steel braces on her polio damaged legs, did tell him that if his daughter, my mother, "hadn't been a crippel"..well that's all he got out before Sam cleared the desk and was on top of the SOB. That's when the principal found out how hard a longshoreman's knuckles really were. Least he had the good sense not to press charges, because had he done so I'm very sure Sam would have killed him.
So Kenny and all, I know how outrageous we find bad manners and how easy it is to look at the shape of an eye or the color of skin, but it's not my experience that the cause of such was genetics but in stupidity, ignorance, carelessness and in a mother and father not stopping in it's tracks bad behaviour.
Omak Cowboy has now gotten off his SoapBox and has left the room.
Over the past year or so I've posted here I've come to know a few of you by the words you write. Kenny, I believe is a good, honest and decent man. He is someone I'd like for a neighbor.
Most of us here are over 40 and a few of us well over that. In our lives many of us have been both well treated and at times ill used by people of many lands and many colors. The people who were laughing at the Arizona Memorial did an unforgivable thing. That was way beyond bad manners and I would not have felt it out of place if some Marine had walked over and flattened a few of those SOBs. Wouldn't mind doing it myself...and I could make it all look like they started it!
By the way, General Sweeney who flew the chase plane over Hiroshima and bombed Nagasaki wrote a very important book "Wars End" in which he has a first person account of when, how and why.
For well beyond 35 years I've studied Asian cultures, Japanese, some Chinese, Thai and a smattering of others. I know something about these people. Sadly I probably know more about thier early culture and what compells them today then many born in those lands.
FYI one the Mongols:
The invasion of Japan by China under Kubli Khan was in 1281. While the Khan was Mongol, the force was mostly Korean and hence the poor feelings between the two societies. The two different stories about the invasion was that the fleet did not make landfall or did make landfall and had to immediately retreat to their ships who were destroyed by the "Kami" the spirit of the divine wind. Did they or didn't they? Who knows?
In the 35 opps 39 years I've studied this culture, I've found many things to admire. I've also seen and experienced other things that are A. Dumb, B. Stupid, C. Deplorable, D. Bad manners beyond belief, and E. Criminal in the extreme. Yet none of these things condemns a people.
The tragic part of history is that in Japan there is no education of the young on what really happened in World War II. There is no mention of Nan King, Batann, the forced prostitution of Korean girls, the attempt to use bio weapons on the US by sending plague ridden rats in balloons nor of the attempt firebombing of our north west forests, nothing on the "medical experiments' by the Japanese version of Mengela, the execution of our POWs by beheading, and on and on.
Kenny you are too young to remember the anti German feelings in this country at the end of W.W.II. And you may not even know that at the end of W.W.I anything German was hated. Poor little dachshund puppies were stoned to death in the streets because they were "German"! Places long known as "German" were changed' German Valley in New Jersey became Long Valley. The shame of being German or of having anything to do with Germany was for years a stain that nothing could wash off. A Kraut was a Kraut and "We ALL know about those people, don't we?" was the sometime spoken and often just a silent agreement between people of "Breeding".
But those dedicated to hating others need little reason and no excuise. Another word I know of is "Half breed", though no one dared say that to my grandfather's face either about his children or grandchildren. Once a school principal, upon expelling my mother for getting to class late because she was dragging 20 pounds of steel braces on her polio damaged legs, did tell him that if his daughter, my mother, "hadn't been a crippel"..well that's all he got out before Sam cleared the desk and was on top of the SOB. That's when the principal found out how hard a longshoreman's knuckles really were. Least he had the good sense not to press charges, because had he done so I'm very sure Sam would have killed him.
So Kenny and all, I know how outrageous we find bad manners and how easy it is to look at the shape of an eye or the color of skin, but it's not my experience that the cause of such was genetics but in stupidity, ignorance, carelessness and in a mother and father not stopping in it's tracks bad behaviour.
Omak Cowboy has now gotten off his SoapBox and has left the room.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
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Kenny Wasserburger
- Posts: 4740
- Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2002 3:53 pm
- Location: Gillette, Wyoming
Omak,
A good post, True I dont remember the Anti German stuff. Then again I was raised in rural Wyo, there was some as my Dad has mentioned, but about half our neighbors at that time were of German background. I guess they got mad at each other?
Dad did mention that my Grandpa told someone once he was Dutch over some anti German stuff but laughed when he did it. Since my Grandpa was one of the best mechanics in the area I suspect no one much cared if his folks came over from Germany in the early 1850's. My great Grandpa Jacob died about 10 years after the war, So I never got to vist with him to hear his take on it. Again if we had lived in a more populated area, with more people to get stupid over such things I am sure it would been alot different story.
I guess my take on this is simple, American Service men would not have the gall to do what was Done at the AZ memorial, yet these people do. I admire their teaching of Bushido and alot of other things. Yet When a race or Nation of people act as they do and teach reverisionst History and refuse to accept the role they played it that war, I would say they still got along way to come.
Most of the folks I know from Germany, are alot different then the people from Japan I have come in contact with. Germany made its mistakes also in WW2. They at least had to good sense to keep some of the camps intact so that we dont forget what did happen.
Kenny
A good post, True I dont remember the Anti German stuff. Then again I was raised in rural Wyo, there was some as my Dad has mentioned, but about half our neighbors at that time were of German background. I guess they got mad at each other?
Dad did mention that my Grandpa told someone once he was Dutch over some anti German stuff but laughed when he did it. Since my Grandpa was one of the best mechanics in the area I suspect no one much cared if his folks came over from Germany in the early 1850's. My great Grandpa Jacob died about 10 years after the war, So I never got to vist with him to hear his take on it. Again if we had lived in a more populated area, with more people to get stupid over such things I am sure it would been alot different story.I guess my take on this is simple, American Service men would not have the gall to do what was Done at the AZ memorial, yet these people do. I admire their teaching of Bushido and alot of other things. Yet When a race or Nation of people act as they do and teach reverisionst History and refuse to accept the role they played it that war, I would say they still got along way to come.
Most of the folks I know from Germany, are alot different then the people from Japan I have come in contact with. Germany made its mistakes also in WW2. They at least had to good sense to keep some of the camps intact so that we dont forget what did happen.
Kenny
We'll raise up our Glasses against Evil Forces, Singing, Whiskey for my men, Beer for my horses.
Wyoming Territory Sharps Shooter
Wyoming Territory Sharps Shooter
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RichBratlee
- Posts: 313
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2003 8:21 pm
- Location: Parkland(Tacoma), WA
I wish to clear up a possable misconception about what I said--I am not unilateraly coming down on all the Japanese nor their entire culture--I am not a prejudiced person--until yuou show me that I should be and then I am very ptredujiced--but only towards the one(s) that gave the reason---I agree with you Omack--there is a lot of good there and some bad as in any culture or group, and it is the bad that I have a big problem with.
OK
NOW nuff said!!
ThANKs Kenny!--Gave me more food for thought!!!--Leaning towards the LRE>
Rich
OK
NOW nuff said!!
ThANKs Kenny!--Gave me more food for thought!!!--Leaning towards the LRE>
Rich
SHILOH 1
USN EM1 (78-83)
Sporter#3 45-70 military butt 34" standard MVA Long range and MVA standard front insert
People with weapons are citizens: People without are subjects!!
USN EM1 (78-83)
Sporter#3 45-70 military butt 34" standard MVA Long range and MVA standard front insert
People with weapons are citizens: People without are subjects!!
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Omak Cowboy
- Posts: 726
- Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 2:35 pm
- Location: Renton, Washington
final thought
Kenney, thank you for the compliment and let me return the same. Good Post.
Your grandfather's comment about being "Dutch" was really accurate in that it was Pennsylvania [b][u]Deutch[/u][/b] for the exact reasons mentioned in my earlier post..but the Deutch became Dutch - so in the end the joke was on those folks who hated our German people and German heritage.
There is a very funny Michael Keaton movie made some ten years or so back "Gung Ho" that of plays on both sides of the culture issue.
As always, funny about that too, but you and I have much more in agreement on this than not.
Your grandfather's comment about being "Dutch" was really accurate in that it was Pennsylvania [b][u]Deutch[/u][/b] for the exact reasons mentioned in my earlier post..but the Deutch became Dutch - so in the end the joke was on those folks who hated our German people and German heritage.
There is a very funny Michael Keaton movie made some ten years or so back "Gung Ho" that of plays on both sides of the culture issue.
As always, funny about that too, but you and I have much more in agreement on this than not.
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
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Timberlake
- Posts: 2063
- Joined: Tue Dec 24, 2002 12:56 pm
- Location: Born and Raised in Iowa
These comments about "Dutch People" got me remembering times long ago, after WWII, when I was young lad in school. My schoolmates would call me and my siblings "DP's". One day I asked what that meant. The kids said "Dutch People". My surname is very German as was my father from both his parents. Dad said DP meant Displaced Persons from post war Europe. He reminded me that I was very German and be proud of it. My handle on this forum comes from my mother's family and has very deep roots in the tradition of this country and its founding fathers. I will shortly be accepted into NSSAR based on the Revolutionary War service records of my Timberlake ancestors. GGG Grandad was a sergeant in the body guard of George Washington.
Dad was only half right, I am proud of my German ancestry but far more proud to be an American.
TL
Dad was only half right, I am proud of my German ancestry but far more proud to be an American.
TL
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Omak Cowboy
- Posts: 726
- Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 2:35 pm
- Location: Renton, Washington
my brother
My brother, Frank retired as a Lt. Col. not long ago. He is a USMC aviator and combat arti officer.
Frank has a talent for languages and is fluent in I think 8, including Sanskrit. Like Kenny he does not suffer fools well.
Some time ago there was a German officer, a Major I think who remarked to my brother that the US military was a mess -- being made of non professionals and they mostly mutts (as in dogs without pedigree). Frank looked at him, smiled his best predatory smile and said in Old German "No, we are not a nation of mutts, we are a nation of conquerors and occupiers!" .
Ah well, another good love gone bad. As this was in the 90s it probably set back German US relations into this century. Like we really care.
Piety there was no French legation for him to play with.
You can take dress the two of us but it's sometimes hard to take us out in public.
Omak
Frank has a talent for languages and is fluent in I think 8, including Sanskrit. Like Kenny he does not suffer fools well.
Some time ago there was a German officer, a Major I think who remarked to my brother that the US military was a mess -- being made of non professionals and they mostly mutts (as in dogs without pedigree). Frank looked at him, smiled his best predatory smile and said in Old German "No, we are not a nation of mutts, we are a nation of conquerors and occupiers!" .
Ah well, another good love gone bad. As this was in the 90s it probably set back German US relations into this century. Like we really care.
Piety there was no French legation for him to play with.
You can take dress the two of us but it's sometimes hard to take us out in public.
Omak
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
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Chuck Wetherington
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 8:54 am
- Location: Atlanta, GA
Thanks for the information on the different types and manufactures of sights. One of the shooters that posted on this thread is a member of my gun club and has offered to let me shoot his Shiloh. His rifle sounds exactly like what I have to have. This whole process is going to be so much fun for me. Keep ALL input coming, your thoughts are greatly appreciated.
Chuck Wetherington
Chuck Wetherington
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Trigger Dr
- Posts: 1944
- Joined: Wed Feb 19, 2003 5:10 pm
- Location: Pacific North WET (Port Orchard)
I have a "T" shirt with a full color scene of destruction, mushroom cloud included. The inscription reads 'MADE IN AMERICA, TESTED IN JAPAN" Staretd nmany a fight just by wearing it.
Trigger Dr
Trigger Dr
Direct ALL e-Mail to jimrmilner@juno.com
NRA LIFE MEMBER
LIMBSAVER® BPCR Team
Prospective Member BPCR Federation
NRA LIFE MEMBER
LIMBSAVER® BPCR Team
Prospective Member BPCR Federation
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Omak Cowboy
- Posts: 726
- Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 2:35 pm
- Location: Renton, Washington
T shirt
Doc, I may need a pair of those.
OMak
OMak
THIS SPACE FOR RENT
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
RIFLE:
45 - 70 #1 Sporter, shotgun buttplate, bone charcoal, 28 inch heavy octagon, semi fancy wood, pewter tip, MVA soule sights. 11 lbs, 10 1/2 ounces.
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bulldog
- Posts: 269
- Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2004 9:03 am
- Location: ND
t shirt
I have this from a veteran friend who was there as a US Navy. He was in Okinawa when the decision was made to slaughter the enemy soldiers there (at high cost to our soldiers too). He was also a guinea pig on a US Navy ship when the US tested an atomic bomb and used our soldiers to see what would happen to them. Plus made them wok in a radioactive environment which diseased many. He says Japan was already trying to surrender. The Russians were ready to invade and massed on the border at high cost to themselves - 20, 000 died just getting there in the cold, etc. Truman sort of betrayed Stalin and dropped the atomic bomb on a civilian populations killing 200,000 women and children to beat him at the draw. Makes me want to throw up!
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Texas Shooter
- Posts: 1092
- Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 3:51 pm
- Location: North Texas