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Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2022 10:20 pm
by flatsguide
I have not tried that...yet. I’m a competitive shooter, mainly 200 yard bullseye off a bench but long range too out to 1000 yards.
My rifle is a Browning .45-70 BPCR that is very accurate. My load is 83gns Swiss 1.5 and a 535 gn DDPP bullet. At 100 yards I can consistently get under 1moa. Groups usually run .625-.750”. However when I’m shooting at a match at 200 yards my groups open up to 1.5 MOA, ES average of 3 inches. 1.5 MOA was the average of 8 of last matches I shot. So if I go by what I experience that is going from .750 MOA at 100 to .1.5 MOA at 200. I know that there is not a linear relationship of MOA and a bit wind, but that jump in MOA I have seems a Bit too much. I’m pretty sure the bullet is clean with no patching or wad sticking to it. This appears to be an exterior ballistics problem. Any ideas or thoughts are most appreciated.
Cheers Richard
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2022 4:16 am
by Randy Bohannon
I would try Jojoba oil before anything else ,applied with a Q-Tip . Recent experience with my 40-70 SS and PP bullets says it works. “ it works well when it works” Don McDowell
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2022 4:58 am
by ian45662
Are you putting anything at all on your patches?
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:53 am
by Kurt
Well they say prep H shrinks the piles so why wouldn't it shrink groups
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:21 pm
by flatsguide
Hi guys hi Ian,
My mention of Preparation H was my poor attempt at humor. I’m not using any lube on the paper. I’m wondering if it’s a bullet problem. My average MV for this load is almost 1250 FPS so I may be going subsonic on the way to 200 yards that may be causing a lot of stability problems. From 0 to 100 yards the load is performing fine but something is occurring between 100 and 200 yards that is opening up the group. So it seems to me a external ballistics problem. I’d like to try a load in my rifle that only changes MV to a level below supersonic maybe around 1070 FPS. That’s a drop in velocity of almost 200 FPS. I’d like to hear from others what they think may be occurring, also the best way to drop the velocity while still using the same bullet.
I seat my DDPP bullet only .075” into the case if I keep it st that depth I would need some kind of filler to reduce the powder charge and therefore velocity. I’m thinking cream of wheat or increasing wad stack thickness. I’m open to ideas.
Thanks guys
Cheers Richard
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:34 pm
by craneman
Richard,
I worked with that bullet for our Browning BPCR'S last fall and was shooting great at 200 yards but found I had more vertical dispersion than I wanted at the spring shoot at Lodi. Since the Browning has zero freebore I have wonderd if the bullet is not making the transition as well as a parallel sided bullet. Of course the winds were really howling at that match so that might have played a roll in that too.
Todd
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:57 pm
by ian45662
flatsguide wrote: ↑Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:21 pm
Hi guys hi Ian,
My mention of Preparation H was my poor attempt at humor. I’m not using any lube on the paper. I’m wondering if it’s a bullet problem. My average MV for this load is almost 1250 FPS so I may be going subsonic on the way to 200 yards that may be causing a lot of stability problems. From 0 to 100 yards the load is performing fine but something is occurring between 100 and 200 yards that is opening up the group. So it seems to me a external ballistics problem. I’d like to try a load in my rifle that only changes MV to a level below supersonic maybe around 1070 FPS. That’s a drop in velocity of almost 200 FPS. I’d like to hear from others what they think may be occurring, also the best way to drop the velocity while still using the same bullet.
I seat my DDPP bullet only .075” into the case if I keep it st that depth I would need some kind of filler to reduce the powder charge and therefore velocity. I’m thinking cream of wheat or increasing wad stack thickness. I’m open to ideas.
Thanks guys
Cheers Richard
That was not a poor attempt at humor. That was me being an idiot
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2022 9:16 am
by Coltsmoke
I would forget what it done at 100yd. and work up loads at 200 or 300yd.
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2022 9:17 am
by Coltsmoke
I would forget what it done at 100yd. and work up loads at 200 or 300yd.
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2022 9:17 am
by Coltsmoke
I would forget what it done at 100yd. and work up loads at 200 or 300yd.
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2022 9:20 am
by Coltsmoke
Sorry about all the repeat, but it was worth saying more than once.
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2022 8:45 pm
by desert deuce
Somehow I just knew mentioning Preparation H would spook Smoke out of the palmettos.
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:29 am
by flatsguide
Lol! Smoke, that what I’m trying to do. Still there must be a reason why it does so well at 100 and not at 200. Just as there are loads that perform well out to 800 or 900 and don’t work at a thousand. These can be generally improved by a shorter bullet or faster twist. My load works well at long distance, no problem there, at the last Creedmoor 150 at Oak Ridge I cleaned the 300 yard target can’t remember the 600 yard and got 3rd place unsupported/no sighters at 1000. for fourth overall. I’m just trying to optimize a load for 200 yards. My thoughts regarding this are as follows, the load I’m using is causing the bullet to go subsonic sometime after reaching 100 but before 200. When it’s transitioning that region it is being disturbed and this is seen at the 200 yard target. After the bullet is disturbed it settles down and accuracy does not suffer. That’s my WAG. I may have to try a GG bullet to reduce powder charge and therefore velocity for 200. ?????.
Al thoughts and ideas welcome.
Cheers Richard
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2022 2:46 pm
by MikeT
flatsguide,
I think your load is going subsonic close to 200 yards and does not have time to recover.
I would increase the velocity, unless 200 yards is the maximum range you intend to shoot.
Keep on hav'n fun!
MikeT
Re: Preparation H for Paper Patch lube
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2022 9:11 pm
by flatsguide
MikeT thanks. I’m going to set my chrono up at 200 yards and see what is going on.
Thanks Richard