Shiloh Rifle Forums

I am the technical adviser to an author who is writing a murder mystery about a Civil War re-enactment battle. He is looking for the name of a manufacturer of scopes used during the Civil War. One of the scenes includes a Confedrate re-enactor who is using a captured 1863 Sharps rifle with a scope on it. What would be the name of the possible manufacturer of a scope for such a rifle?

Hmmm. let me see if I have this right...

1. The author is writing about a modern murder.
2. That murder takes place during a civil war re-enactment.
3. The weapon is stolen from a Confederate soldier.
4. That weapon is a 1863 Sharps.
5. That Sharps is scoped.

If that is correct:

1. Few people would use an orignal 1863 in re-enactments.
2. Fewer still (as in zero) would use an original 1863 Sharps with an original scope. No rare, too fagile, too valuable.
3. Anyone still using the forementioned would never loose it.

Now the good news:

1. Civil war reenactors would use a copy of a 1863 Sharps.
2. That rifle might be appropriately scoped.
3. That rifle might be lost/stolen.

That scope might be one of the following...Parson, MVA, RHO, Lyman, Mitchell and others.

Helpful?

So sorry...should have been..

Confedrate soldier using a captured Union Sharps..

All the other data is still relevant.

My guess is that being realistic isn't going to cut it, soo......lets seperate the man from the boys...

In 1848 Morgan James of Utica, N.Y. invented the long-tube telescopic sight that would be used by Civil War marksmen just 13 years later. Priced at about $20, these telescopes were no more than four power. But in the hands of a skilled soldier with a sharp wit and keen eye, these devices offered sufficient magnification for aiming a rifle with deadly, long-distance accuracy.

The long-tube sight mounted on a heavy benchrest rifle gave the marksman who was selected to carry it prestige among his fellow soldiers. The sharpshooter thus armed was considered an independent character, used only for special service, with the privilege of going to any part of the line where in his own judgement he could do the most good. The weapon indicated that the man carrying it was among the most trusted soldiers and best shots.

Some of the prewar American-made benchrest rifles found their way into the Confederate army, however the preferred weapon of the Southern sharpshooter was the Whitworth rifle imported from England. Shortly after the Civil War, the army replaced these ponderous weapons and their long telescopic sights with more modern, faster-firing rifles, and the benchrest was no longer used by the military.

You now know more than 99.99% of people on the subject.....

But, I still think that if your author wants to keep from having us shake our heads, he'll heed my original notes. Nobody and I mean NOBODY is going to take one of these rifles to a re-enactment.

Send my check to the usual address......

Oh yea, you probably want to see an original "James" scope, well this is your lucky day.

Thanks for all the great info. That's just what we needed. I guess I was not clear enough in my first posting. The novel's re-enactor will be using a Shiloh 1863 with a MVA scope. But he wants to refer to what COULD have been possible in the Civil War. His character wants to use the Shiloh rather than the Whitworth because it is more practical for a re-enactor to use. He's the bad guy and he's going to commit a murder at long range (about 300 yards). By the way, the author's name is Chuck Logan. If you go to Amazon, you will find the books he has written.

As far as any scoped union 1863 Sharps used by the "green coats" during the war, there were none. As in zero. As far as any records that I can find on the subject. Actually very few of the sharpshooter rifles were even double set triggers. Most were heavy military single trigger. The only scoped union rifles in use in Berdan's and the other union sharpshooter group were the 25 to 35 lb equilivant of bench rest muzzle loading guns.

The south didn't even acess to Sharps rifles except a few 1853 model that were individually purchased prior to the war and a few copies of the 1863 that were made in Richmond Va. The copies were of very low quality and unfit for this type of work. The rifle coveted by the southern sharpshooter without a doubt was the Witworth with it unusal, yet incredibly accurate hexagonal bore, and the rest of the rifles were idividually aquired heavy target guns. The Witworth fired what is commonly called the bolt. A hexagonal .459 projectile with a slight twist. Some withworths were scoped the rest had ladder vernier sights.

Therefore, a wartime southerner with a scoped 1863 would have never existed.

The south didn't even acess(sic) to Sharps rifles except a few 1853 model that were individually purchased prior to the war and a few copies of the 1863 that were made in Richmond Va.

Many Confederate units were very well armed with war booty & battlefield pickups, e.g. Sharps, Spencers, Gallaghers, Henrys, etc.

Don't forget the Whitworth rifles with the hex rifling.
Jim

Your honor and jury, I have endeavored to show a direct link between poor ventilation during the creation of lead cast bullets and the marked decline of reading and writing by those involved. As further proof, I offer the testimony to be found within this very thread.

Before I close, I would like to mention the hex rifling of the Whitworth rifle as well as the fact that some of these rifles, themselves, may have had hex rifling.

Thank you, the prosecution rests

DY: I see that you've posted graphic results of "poor ventilation during the creation of lead cast bullets"....

DAMN YANKEE wrote:Your honor and jury, I have endeavored to show a direct link between poor ventilation during the creation of lead cast bullets and the marked decline of reading and writing by those involved. As further proof, I offer the testimony to be found within this very thread.

Before I close, I would like to mention the hex rifling of the Whitworth rifle as well as the fact that some of these rifles, themselves, may have had hex rifling.

Thank you, the prosecution rests

Looks like you morphed in a HK PSG-1. Coincidently it also has a Hex bore.

If this re-enactor should carry a Whitworth rifle, where would he buy it? This character is very careful and calculating. He has the same mindset as the best bpcr shooters in regards to his equipment. He would not use anything but the best. This leaves out reproductions from Europe. He would not have one! So, does anyone know of a company in the U.S. that makes a very high-quality Whitworth? Something that will give him Shiloh quality and accuracy?

Troll,

The HK has a polygon bore. Something like the whit but different. I have shot HK's quite a bit the 91-93 and a PSG-1. I still use a P9S in 45 acp as my conceled Carry pistol. No its not very conceled and it rides very nice in a shoulder Holster. A good friend here in Gillette has several 91's and a PSG-1, Wish I had bought one many years ago.

DY your picture smithing is interesting, Makes me kinda wonder with your skills, that funky looking gemmer with the maple stock, if its the real mcCoy? That gun is too pretty to have seen much use. Something bout the lock just does not seem right or the hammer?

I have a 45-110 made by Shiloh in 1994, rifle has about 19,000 rounds through it and shows quite a bit of use. My sharps LR express, is scoped, the MVA 23 inch model, with it I have plenty of elevation to 1000 plus yards. The 28 inch model requires the use of a much taller block in the rear mount to make it to a 1000. The full lenght tube models are good to about 6-700 yards due to the lack of elevation with the longer distance between the mounts.

I know my set up is usable to 1000 yards and have about .300 more elevation in the rear mount beyond my 1000 yard zeros.

I have seen a couple pictures of scoped Whits that were used in the War of Northern Agression, I have seen 2 such rifles and both had very short scopes 20 or so inches and perhaps 10 to 12 inches between the mounts, at the time I was thinking it quite odd. When I decided To get a scope for my Sharps for Long Range and Silhouette I soon understood the Merit of the shorter tube and close distances between the mounts.

Just some thoughts and experiances based on my shooting long range with a scoped sharps.

Kenny Wasserburger

Whitworths have been fitted with the side mounted Davidson scope. This form of mounting permitted the proper adjustment for elevations required for long range shooting. See the following on my web site:

http://www.lrml.org/collecting/whitworth/c529.htm

David

Doc,
Dixie sells a Parker-Hale Whitworth manufactured by Gibbs Rifle Co. It is a very faithful reproduction. They also sell a Pedersoli Mortimer Whitworth rifle. However, It is a half stock and does NOT have the hex rifling.
Jim